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Post by nomadicmaniac on May 18, 2017 10:50:28 GMT -8
I apologize ahead of time if this question has been asked before, But i want to ask the voice actors on this board both new and experienced what their general opinion is on pay to play sites such as voices.com, voices123, and voicebunny and if any of these sites are something i should pursue as an aspiring voice actor. i've heard both good and bad things about both of these sites, so i want your complete honest opinion on them
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Mike V
Member
 
Posts: 54
I Am A(n): Semi-Professional Voice Actor
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Post by Mike V on May 18, 2017 23:49:22 GMT -8
I'd rather they were cheaper, if you want my personal opinion, but all that aside, I was doing some stuff on voices.com. I wouldn't use it as a primary source of auditions, or any of the other sites, but it does help make that extra money...if you can land a gig, it's VERY competitive. If you got $50USD, give voices.com a shot for a month, and see how you like it, but be consistent as hell in the auditions and check everyday.
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Post by tomfreeman on May 20, 2017 5:53:14 GMT -8
I am on all 3 of these sites - although Voicebunny isn't really a pay-to-play, as it costs nothing to join and they even pay for auditions (although you have to have an initial site audition approved for sound quality etc) Over the last year, both Voices.com and Voice123 have more than paid their subscription costs for me - particularly Voices.com as I landed a national UK TV commercial. But as a British VO artist there is less competition and fewer jobs, so if you're in the US you may need to audition more to have the same chance of a hire. Bear in mind the auditioning is good practice!
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Post by Brittany Ann Phillips on May 21, 2017 19:01:12 GMT -8
I've been a part of Voice Bunny for a little while before they had set up a questionnaire which claims they only allow 2% of the applicants to join. Voice Bunny has been dubbed 'the fast food' of voice over. Clients will expect an insanely short turnaround time (a couple of hours), often disregarding time zone differences and drop you for another voice actor who can do it faster. While there is no fee and you do get paid to audition, it is only if they find your audition acceptable, and will pay only $1 or $2. The actual pay itself for gigs is quite low for the amount of work needed done. It's really not worth it in my opinion.
Voice123 and Voices.com pays much better ($100 minimum). However, Voices.com takes 20% cut of your earnings while Voice123 does not. Both have a yearly membership fee of $400 (no monthly plan options from what I could find out). As Tom Freeman mentioned, North American gigs are much, much more competitive and you will have to audition like crazy.
While using a P2P can be useful with gaining experience and building your portfolio, it's best to network and market yourself instead. Just my two cents.
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timbick
Member
 
Posts: 2
I Am A(n): Professional Voice Actor
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Post by timbick on Nov 14, 2017 6:16:55 GMT -8
Pay to play can be worth doing as a part of your overall marketing mix. I concur with some of the above - Voicebunny is bottom of the barrel desperate stuff, the others can be worthwhile, but track your audition to job conversion rate for at least six months to see if a given site is working for you.
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Post by Lady Stardust ★ on Nov 24, 2017 2:05:32 GMT -8
I discuss P2Ps a little bit in my stickied thread about getting into voiceover. I didn't discuss VoiceBunny in there since they don't charge a yearly fee, but I'll second Brittany Ann's comment about how their expectations are rather unreasonable as they want everything done SUPER FAST and for DIRT CHEAP, plus their quality requirements are insane. Rather than allowing the clients to determine whether, say, the tiniest bit of room echo is a dealbreaker or not (which many times is fine as they are going to be editing and mixing with music for an internal corporate video or something), their "QA managers" look for every reason they possibly can to say "nope, this isn't good enough." So very mediocre reads get through all the time by people who obviously lack VO training or experience, just because they can afford to shell out for a home studio. Meanwhile, people who are skilled and experienced and have a decent recording setup but not a full-on booth or studio get rejected because of the tiniest bit of echo or background hiss that you can only hear if you turn your headphones all the way up (simple noise reduction can easily fix that tiny bit of hiss but they say they don't allow noise reduction and you just need a "perfect" recording space from the start. You also aren't supposed to use USB mics, even though many people have been able to get good sound from them.)
The turnaround time expectations are a big part of why I dislike P2Ps. If they allowed 24 hours, it would be reasonable, but sites like VoiceBunny and Voices seem to expect you to turn in your audio within 4-6 hours, which isn't always feasible because of jobs and timezones. It also conditions clients to expect that they can pay crap rates and GET this crazy turnaround time, because there are enough people who are desperate enough for work that they WILL sit in front of their computer all day ready to jump on that $50 job the second it comes in. I don't disparage anyone for wanting to work, and I have some friends who do really well on sites like Voices, but it all depends if you're willing to "play the game". If you are a regularly working VO actor you probably don't need it and it's just going to cause you headaches.
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Post by cbdroege on Nov 25, 2017 2:14:30 GMT -8
I discuss P2Ps a little bit in my stickied thread about getting into voiceover. I didn't discuss VoiceBunny in there since they don't charge a yearly fee, but I'll second Brittany Ann's comment about how their expectations are rather unreasonable as they want everything done SUPER FAST and for DIRT CHEAP, plus their quality requirements are insane. Rather than allowing the clients to determine whether, say, the tiniest bit of room echo is a dealbreaker or not (which many times is fine as they are going to be editing and mixing with music for an internal corporate video or something), their "QA managers" look for every reason they possibly can to say "nope, this isn't good enough." So very mediocre reads get through all the time by people who obviously lack VO training or experience, just because they can afford to shell out for a home studio. Meanwhile, people who are skilled and experienced and have a decent recording setup but not a full-on booth or studio get rejected because of the tiniest bit of echo or background hiss that you can only hear if you turn your headphones all the way up (simple noise reduction can easily fix that tiny bit of hiss but they say they don't allow noise reduction and you just need a "perfect" recording space from the start. You also aren't supposed to use USB mics, even though many people have been able to get good sound from them.) The turnaround time expectations are a big part of why I dislike P2Ps. If they allowed 24 hours, it would be reasonable, but sites like VoiceBunny and Voices seem to expect you to turn in your audio within 4-6 hours, which isn't always feasible because of jobs and timezones. It also conditions clients to expect that they can pay crap rates and GET this crazy turnaround time, because there are enough people who are desperate enough for work that they WILL sit in front of their computer all day ready to jump on that $50 job the second it comes in. I don't disparage anyone for wanting to work, and I have some friends who do really well on sites like Voices, but it all depends if you're willing to "play the game". If you are a regularly working VO actor you probably don't need it and it's just going to cause you headaches. This was my experience with Vb, and because of it I mostly stopped working with them. I left my account open in case any previous clients wanted to book me directly through them, since there'd be no other way for them to find me, but otherwise I wrote off the service entirely. One thing I would recommend from my experience is to think twice before doing business with a middle man who demands that both parties remain anonymous to each other. If they make this demand it means that they know that all other parties would cut them out if they were able to (which means they know they add very little actual value to the process or product). Much better to work through a service that accepts the possibility that actors and producers might work together without them in the future, giving them incentive to be a real value add.
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Post by Rebekah Amber Clark on Nov 25, 2017 3:57:17 GMT -8
I would also think that having to remain anonymous to the clients would really interfere with being credited properly in the finished projects. Or is this not the case?
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Post by cbdroege on Nov 25, 2017 5:32:11 GMT -8
I would also think that having to remain anonymous to the clients would really interfere with being credited properly in the finished projects. Or is this not the case? Yes. This is also irritating. I've remained uncredited on every job I've done for a Vb client, so not only is it too fast and underpaid, but it also doesn't get me any exposure. It's a racket.
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Post by Kyotosomo on Nov 25, 2017 10:18:24 GMT -8
I would also think that having to remain anonymous to the clients would really interfere with being credited properly in the finished projects. Or is this not the case? Yes. This is also irritating. I've remained uncredited on every job I've done for a Vb client, so not only is it too fast and underpaid, but it also doesn't get me any exposure. It's a racket. I don't necessarily care about the exposure, but it does results in a lack of proof when you stick one of these jobs on your resume which is a pretty lame situation.
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Post by Lady Stardust ★ on Nov 25, 2017 17:18:05 GMT -8
Yes. This is also irritating. I've remained uncredited on every job I've done for a Vb client, so not only is it too fast and underpaid, but it also doesn't get me any exposure. It's a racket. I don't necessarily care about the exposure, but it does results in a lack of proof when you stick one of these jobs on your resume which is a pretty lame situation. They make it very clear in the terms of service that you're not allowed to use any parts of projects you did for them on your demo reels, either. If you're on VB I recommend doing what cbdroege said and leaving your profile up in case clients will book you directly, because that means 1) they have to pay the rates YOU set on there (granted, if it's too high, you'll never get jobs on that site---but it will at least keep out the people who want to pay $5 for an hour's worth of audio, for instance). You'll still have to deal with the hassle of getting the magic formula for the QA team to approve your sample - one recurring client books me on there for really quick promos for kids' events done in a little girl's voice, and I actually had a QA manager reject the read for the voice sounding "high pitched" even though that's LITERALLY WHAT THE CLIENT BOOKED ME FOR ON MULTIPLE OCCASIONS and doing it in a more mature voice would make it inconsistent and not what they asked for. They forwarded it to the client after I contested it, but it was still annoying. I can understand the QA aspect in terms of making sure there aren't glaring audio flaws, the voice actor reads the script as-written without pronunciation errors etc, but they meddle way too much in terms of expecting their voice actors to be professional-level sound engineers when half the time the clients couldn't care less as long as it sounds reasonably clean and the delivery is what they want. They will also send multiple emails and text messages (if you sign up for text notifications) reminding you that the job is "urgent". The automated system sends a reminder after 6 hours, and then I think if it goes to 8 hours their team sends you an email asking you when you will be delivering your audio -_- At one point I literally told them "I record regularly in-person and have a standard job as well, and if a request comes in at 5 am I'm not going to see it right away as I'm asleep, but I WILL deliver all audio within 24 hours." They laid off a bit after that.
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Post by BeauVO on Nov 27, 2017 1:44:36 GMT -8
What I personally found about P2P sites is that different sites will be better or worse for you based on your voice and personality plus your needs and wants as a voice actor. However what's frustrating is to find out whether you like them or not you need to sign up and give them a good go but it can be expensive to do that. For example I signed up to Voice123 for a year and knew very quickly that it wasn't going to be for me but then you're stuck with it for a year. It asked you all these questions about your voice, job types and everything and then would still send you so much irrelevant stuff (or not send you really relevant stuff); the rating system was bizarre and overall I had a frustrating experience on there (literally if you Google " reasons not to join Voice123" a detailed blog post I wrote about my experience on there comes top of the search results) but I also think a part of that was the fact I'm young and English - I don't think I was a good fit for there anyway. For a different voice type with different goals though, the site could be great and others have had good success on there, which is awesome. I totally agree about the lack of proof being a pain too, something that has affected me. I have certainly found P2Ps to be a good way to get more experience and some nice money sometimes too. You just might need to invest and hope for the best to find out
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Post by scorchedearth on Sept 13, 2019 12:42:32 GMT -8
Voices123.com As of this writing, Voices123 seems to be the most reputable of a bad lot. Like the mod above said: depending on your age, voice-type, and target market, it might work for you, or it might not. Voices.com Once upon a time, this was the “go-to” website for freelance VO talent and their clients. Sadly, in recent years, the owners of voices.com appear to have gotten a bit greedy, and as of this writing, have been accused by quite a few VO talent of unethical payment practices. In this interview with the founder and CEO of voices.com, when the interviewer questions him about these alleged practices, it’s quite obvious that he’s clutching at straws. soundcloud.com/voices-dot-com-complaints/voices-dot-com-interviewandrewrandall.com/voices/Voicebunny.com Even by already abysmal PTP standards, Voicebunny.com (which, if I’m not mistaken is owned by the same company that owns voices123) is a joke. I once submitted a demo sample to VB and they rejected it, saying that there was too much room echo...even though it was recorded in a sound booth with wall-to-wall Rockwool! After that, I closed my account with them. I don’t have the time or patience for nonsense like this. fiverr.com This sight is often used for scratch samples by ad agencies. You might get allot of work with them...if you charge cheaply enough; But be warned! You might actually get blacklisted by clients for this very reason! www.stevenjaycohen.com/2015/02/23/why-i-dont-worry-about-fiverr-anymore/UpWork.com If you’re new to VO, this site is good for “cutting your teeth” and getting necessary experience while building a portfolio of paid work. Be aware though that the clients are cheapskate low-ballers who expect you to do several hours of quality work for as little as $5. Yes, you read correctly: Five. Measly. Bucks. I would recommend using a nom-de-plume and pic of a relative so that you don’t get blacklisted. This is not an exhaustive list; however these are the major players of the PTP world. Happy recording! Scorched Earth
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